Diehard Exclusive
Unlock Your Full Philadelphia Flyers Experience
This premium content is a Philadelphia Flyers Diehard exclusive.
DIEHARD MEMBERSHIP
$79.99
/year
As a Diehard, you'll get:
Plus
Join Now
Cancel anytime. No questions asked.
Manage Membership
You're already a Diehard! Manage your subscription from your dashboard.
Already a Diehard?
Sign In
21 Comments (8 conversations)
MarioD
Did the Flyers learn a lesson this time or are they going to make the same mistake a third time in a row?
The Tortorella experience draws strong parralels to the AV experience, namely trading players away after destroying their value and hanging on to the coach too long after he lost the locker room.
jamesiy
Also, we should avoid hiring a coach where it is his last stop and everyone knows it.
bjm0822
They hired the wrong guy for the wrong job. This day was inevitable. Hopefully they are a little more thoughtful in the next hire given the state of the team. And maybe start adding some difference-making players in addition to Michkov would help as well.
guadzilla
Cherry-picking individual sentences to make a point is not good journalism, Charlie. The context of Briere’s statements about them having differences along the way was more to illustrate that this breakup didnt happen because of a difference of opinions. And “it’s exhausting dealing with complicated people”? Really? That’s Marcus Hayes/Les Bowen level of writing.
Briere made it very clear that the firing had to do with the past few weeks – basically, the team went into a spiral and wasn’t showing any signs of emerging from it, and Torts didnt seem too interested in hammering the players to play at the same level as if they were contending for a playoff berth. That’s pretty much the reason.
This article seems more like a case of you trying to justify the narrative in your head about Torts.
Bob MCH
Its clear you are a blind apologist for Torts. You have been defending this coach all season. Sorry you lost your favorite coach. Ge was a bad fit for a rebuild, not a bad coach. Get real. Charlie’s article today on this firing was one of his best, was balanced, well written, and true to the core. It was insightful behind the scenes, when deep, and gave necessary and excellent perspective from inside the management of this dreadful organization. Torts was an old fashioned bully in style, and that dog don’t hunt in a rebuild. Plain and simple. He was hired by Fletch because Fletch overvalued the talent on this roster and felt he needed a kick-them-in-the-pants coach to get into the playoffs. But the truth was, the roster was substandard, and hiring Torts was an incorrect match for what needed to really happen, a rebuild, which means go backwards two steps to go forward five. Not Torts environment territory. The key mistake here was keeping Torts when Jones and DB were hired. But given their inexperience, HIlferty may have wanted continuity and a long-timer with proven success to help the new guys transition. Makes sense on paper, but in reality, Torts was never going to be right for a rebuild, which he essentially stated the other night, which forced his immediate firing. Torts fired himself in protest to the rebuild. Period. So cry all you want, but Torts can now go find a strong roster to kick over the hill to a Cup, and Flyers can go find a nurturer coach for development of youth, while DB and Jones get on with what really matters, which is to acquire a half dozen elite young talents. But to go after Charlie is nonsense and Bullsh_t. This one of Charlies best journalistic pieces. He gets it. Timely and well done.
guadzilla
I am a Flyers fan and yes, I do think Torts was a good coach. I also think Charlie is an excellent writer and one of the reasons I have an AllPhly account is because of him.
That doesn’t mean I can’t criticise him for lazy journalism and that is exactly what this was: using selective sentences without full context to buttress a pre-formed opinion is not even close to his best work.
As for the personal attacks – your opinion isn’t nearly important enough for me to even bother responding. If you want to talk hockey, happy to engage, otherwise you can bark all you want and I will ignore.
Les Bowen
Hey thanks for the compliment! 😄
yo
😂😂😂 well played
Bob MCH
Any time Les. You have been and still are one of the best writers this town has ever seen. Been enjoying your work for a long time.
guadzilla
Haha, I may not like your writing style one bit, but I’ll echo what was said – “well played, indeed”.
Andrew Rothman
First of all, anyone lobbing a stray at the legend Les Bowen instantly loses all credibility. Like, what?
Second, you acknowledge that Charlie is an excellent reporter. He’s covered the Flyers for years. So maybe, just maybe, this article is coming from the place of someone who is well enough informed about the team to be able to be able to write a balanced and insightful analysis of Briere’s words, rather than assuming he’s cherry-picking quotes like it’s a 10th grade five paragraph essay.
This need to play “gotcha” journalism police is so bizarre.
rawgman
Going back to some of the Torts quotes in the Pelletier article, and the comments he made after the Toronto game, it seems pretty obvious to me that Torts was not interested in altering his coaching at all given that the team was not making the playoffs. The on ice actions point in that direction as well. Not experimenting more with the Power Play, not giving guys like Pelletier more heavy minutes to see what he does with it, benching York. It all points to a coach who was in “win at all costs” mode, to the detriment of a team that is very much rebuilding. So when he says he’s not interested in coaching this kind of team, it says to me he was not interested in adjusting his approach in the short term for more long term health of the club. That is very much a disconnect between the FO and the HC. I am not sure what Torts thought he was signing up for, or if he changed his mind along the way, but I have to agree with the decision to cut him loose.
Bob MCH
To you Charlie, extremely well done journalistic piece today on Torts firing and Brierre’s comments and reasons. One of your best ever. Truly a top notch professional writing piece. Great job Charlie, and you know I can be tough in my assessments. I have been a writer and editor for decades for a large publication, and I know great writing when I see it. Well researched, well presented, well written and very timely. Keep them coming as Flyers rebuild gets into acceleration mode, with the new coach hire, the draft, and free agency / trade off season stuff. Brilliant work Charlie.
guadzilla
This isn’t journalism. This is an opinion piece.
Reporting – he goes to the team source and tries to get facts about what happened.
Opinion piece – he writes what he thinks happened based on his attempts at connecting the dots.
Now you know – you are welcome.
Charlie O'Connor
AuthorThis was not an opinion column. It was an analysis of Briere’s press conference, informed by first-hand observations and conversations with sources.
I’m sorry that you didn’t like it, but you must admit that your clear pro-Tortorella bias is a not-insignificant part of why.
guadzilla
Like I said, I freely admit I have a pro-Torts bias (and some of it is also a counter to the depressingly inane nonsense I read online about his coaching, but that’s a “me” issue). But I am also objective enough to update my opinions based on credible facts. Eg, if you had reported that your sources informed you that most of the players were sick of playing for Torts, I would certainly revise what I think.
And that’s kinda the reason I have pushed back on the article – interpreting things based on press releases becomes a Rorschach test of sorts, where everyone interprets things based on their pre-held opinions.
My impression, reading your article, is that it was driven more by you interpreting the sub-text of what was said. Which is what prompted by response. There was nothing in the article indicating that you had validated some of these inferences from insider sources – atleast, that’s how it reads (and I quickly glanced at the post again, and it still reads the same to me).
Anyway, this is over and enough has been written. Upwards and onwards to what they do with their 10th pick.
xoffsetx
Thanks Charlie – probably the most insightful piece I’ve read on the situation.
Charles Mendels
I agree
dkon21
Thanks for piecing together what Danny meant by the “accumulation” it’s been hard to stay engaged with this team after the deadline and the skid. It seems like the biggest hurdle was shifting gears from “trying to win” to “see what we’ve got in these guys”.
Neil Baker
maybe a cable company that’s not good at cable shouldn’t also own a hockey franchise
John Starbuck
Very perceptive take, Charlie. Torts was clearly very frustrated. Perhaps that frustration, not only due to awful goal play and having four skaters traded, but perhaps because it had become obvious that Torts was not considered an equal member of the management team. Torts made it clear that he felt like the Flyers were his final destination.
My guess with the York thing, is that Torts and York got into a shouting match in front of other players. That would have been the final straw, and a reason why York had to sit on the bench for an entire game. Management making it clear to the players that despite the result of Torts being fired, that doesn’t make shouting at coaches in public acceptable.
I am certain that Briere knows there will be a spotlight on his choice of coach by the hockey world as well as Flyers fans.