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12 Comments (6 conversations)
Robert Marcin
Coach Torts North Star is accountability. The players earn the roster, their lines and their minutes. He is blunt there. Yet, in hypocritical fashion, there’s no accountability for the himself, whether it’s playing favorites, demoting solid performers over a single, glaring mistake, or skipping a post game press conference. And power play coach must be exempt too. But Frost, Brink, Foerster, or Andre they are held accountable. I never knew that the North Star, ie accountability, was optional but it seems to be the case here.
guadzilla
Skipping a post-game conference is so low on my list of things to worry about. As long as he keeps developing the players and keeps instilling structurally sound hockey, I am ok with that.
This team was universally regarded as a bottom-5 team and came within a whisker and bad goalie karma of making the playoffs. They’ve been playing the most structurally sound hockey since the days of Terry Murray.
People are so bent out of shape over-analysing single moves in a vacuum or hating everything the Flyers do because they aren’t tanking that they are missing the forest for the trees.
Yes, the PP does suck (and is easily explained by a lack of elite talent). The PK, surprisingly, has been weak and that is something the coaches need to fix. Those are legitimate discussions to have – especially the PKill. But complaining about who he benches/doesnt bench?
On what basis does ANYONE here have an opinion one way or the other? Has anyone here ever developed young hockey players at the NHL level? Does anyone know specifically what the players are being asked to work upon, what they are lagging behind and why?
The priority for the team:
1). Focus on the long-term development of the players first and foremost
2). Within the constraints of #1, field a competitive team that plays to win
I have no issues if he benches a player playing well if there are developmental issues in their game that can be fixed by doing so – even if it means a few losses.
DA-FlyersMan
I don’t pretend to understand advanced stats (generally I just take Charlie’s word for it) and I’m generally a fan of Tortorella. And I still don’t like this move. Even if you’re just an eye-test person and agree that Andrae isn’t playing well, Torts still keeps trotting Yegor Zamula out there every game and near as I can tell he hasn’t been good by any measure, statistical or otherwise. I’m left scratching my head.
guadzilla
It’s more likely just a numbers game – but for everyone who seems to be playing “back seat coach” here :
Maybe… just maybe… the goal isnt to just be satisfied with his performance now but to help him become the best player he can be.
Maybe… just maybe… relying on generic analytics numbers – while directionally sound – lacks the granularity and specificity needed to decide on a player’s development arc.
Or maybe… just maybe… everyone here has more first hand experience on how to develop players – more so that a lifelong coach who actually HAS done a good job developing players.
Yeah, I know which way I lean on that.
It amazes me how people can have such strong opinions without any actual knowledge.
guadzilla
Edit: *first hand knowledge
Charlie O'Connor
AuthorI cannot and will never accept the appeal to authority argument. John Tortorella is not infallible. We should not just assume everything he does is correct just because he is John Tortorella. Authority figures make mistakes all the time.
DA-FlyersMan
While I agree that Tortorella, as the coach of the team, has first-hand insights that we don’t have and I too am annoyed by people who reflexively criticize everything he does because he’s an “old school hockey man”, I still think he’s wrong on this move. One can have all the information and still make an incorrect decision.
Matt
What a terrible take. The entire point of this website (and Charlie in particular) is an in-depth look at Philly sports with a trend towards analytics. If you just want a game recap I’m sure ESPN has an AI written one for you. If you want to read someone suck up to Torts and write puff pieces, go back to the Athletic.
Mike Rhine
As someone who likes Tortorella and strongly believes advanced stats and mock drafts were developed by people who didn’t play sports to suck the joy out of them for people who have I don’t see any justification for the decision to sit Andrae.
You don’t need a spreadsheet to see that they tend to carry play when he’s on the ice and their D is structured better when he’s in the lineup
Matt
I like to think Torts finally got the message that we need to tank a bit and decided to sit his 2nd best D man. We already know Andrea is part of the future based on results so let’s send him down and bank some losses. Then I realize I’m drunk and that it’s Torts….
Andrew Chambers
I like to think he is looking at the 2025 draft and some of the centers who may be available in the mid teens and thinking he can replace his “toilet seat” with one of them lol
Stephen Schmidt
Charlie, I’m wondering if you, or anyone else has brought up some of these advanced stats when asking Torts questions? It doesn’t seem to happen often AFAICT. Torts generally seems dismissive of it when he references it… “go ask our stats people”, or “something our stats people would know”. Why doesn’t he know these things… seems like he doesn’t care to use it at all and will live and die with the eye-test